Home Defense - Bird Shot

[wbrown609]

I think some of you are missing the point. Bird shot is not the most lethal option. There are much better self defense loads. The video is trying to show and some are trying to make the point that bird shot may be lethal enough while providing protection against going through interior walls......That being said, I don't keep a hd shotgun handy, so I don't have a dog in the fight.

[tman]

If you think that bird shot is a viable stopping option in your home, then thats your business. But theres a reason they make "buckshot" for deer, and "birdshot" for birds. The reason is because it takes a larger projectile to kill a larger target and not just wound it. Sure, most home invasion, close quarter type, contact happens within <30 feet. Are you sure your situation will fall into the "most of the time" category??? In my opinion putting birdshot in your home defense gun is setting yourself up for failure in a very critical situation.

Of course I would use birdshot if thats all I had. Its definitely better than yelling for help, but to purposefully limit my lethality at a time when you are cornered in your home against someone who is trying to hurt you is not the brightest idea.

If you're terribly worried about over penetration through walls, then back your shot size back to No. 4 buck, or T's like somebody mentioned earlier. Theres room for compromise but to purposefully put No. 8's in your HD gun is a mistake you might not ever get to chance to make twice.

[Silentweapon338]

What do folks in the armed forces use in their shotguns?

Thats not exactly a fair comparison. If Joe American is defending his home from the common criminal he is concerned about over penetration so he doesn't shoot his wife and kid in the next room, or possibly even a neighbor in the next house.

Joe American is kicking doors killing rag heads he could care less if he kills the whole room full of jihadis. The mil may say they don't want them to, but the mil is the one issuing the 00 buck.

Also the same mil that gives them a M2 to ride around town doing patrol. Talk about over penetration. But who cares it is a war zone. I want my side to have the biggest badest most lethal weapons on the face of the planet. I wanna win if we are gonna play!

The demonstration was for in the house, not outside. I think it showed what many folks new. If you still find it inadequate lets see what happens if I shoot the lower half of the body to stop you from progressing forward (not your body a hypothetical). A few extra rounds because adrenaline was pumping after the initial shot. You will drop to the ground trust me. You may crawl, but I bet you will wanna go backwards, and that is if your head didn't become a conversational piece for serve pro to talk about as they clean up the blood soaked room.

[Bad Habit]

Using birds hot goes against every self defense LEGAL advice that comes from experts in the defense of people who have exercised their right to self defense.

[HARV]

What a shame,that home intruder woulda been good on the Egg (registered trademark)

[Griffin]

What do folks in the armed forces use in their shotguns?

00, the odds of it getting used on anything besides a door are slim but I have seen it happen. I wonder why everyone gets so spun up on over penetration with shotguns? I'm sure none of these guys have hand guns or ARs as "home defense" weapons.
A cliff note, if you do shoot someone with bird shot and they live (which they likely will unless it's very close) Their lawyer will gut you for everything you're worth.

[billyjack]

If someone breaks into my home I don't want to warn them. I don't want to scare them. I don't want to make them rethink their actions. I don't want to wound them or severe their arm from their body. I want them dead. Not because I'm a cold-hearted killer or because I want to kill someone. But because I made a decision tree. And the logical worst conclusion is that the intruder will kill me, my children, my wife, and my dogs. Bird shot may kill a man. A bush axe could also do the job. But I'm not taking the chance on either of those options because they increase the chances that the worst case scenario in my decision tree occurs.

A dead man can't kill me.

He also can't sue me.

[MorningWoody]

If someone breaks into my home I don't want to warn them. I don't want to scare them. I don't want to make them rethink their actions. I don't want to wound them or severe their arm from their body. I want them dead. Not because I'm a cold-hearted killer or because I want to kill someone. But because I made a decision tree. And the logical worst conclusion is that the intruder will kill me, my children, my wife, and my dogs. Bird shot may kill a man. A bush axe could also do the job. But I'm not taking the chance on either of those options because they increase the chances that the worst case scenario in my decision tree occurs.

A dead man can't kill me.

He also can't sue me.

Couldnt have said it better myself!!

[Griffin]

Bush axe... I like where your head is

[Silentweapon338]

Look you guys obviously don't subscribe to the more is better theory.

A shot gun with bird shot if he is in the bedroom.

A shot gun with 00 for the living room.

A AR or AK what ever your preference for the north wing of the house (been wanting to remodel anyway)

240 for the immediate entrances.

m2 if they try to make back out the drive way. Gotta stop them from getting to the next house.

1911....well as pointed out dead men tell no tails.

Don't worry about the legal team or the collateral damage.

Obviously I'm joking. I wish no one had to even discuss such nonsense.

Hopefully no one will ever have to employee their home defense strategy.

[gooseaholic]

He also can't sue me.

But his heirs and family can/will if they believe there is something to gain.

[Silentweapon338]

[Bownut]

But his heirs and family can/will if they believe there is something to gain.

That's going to happen anyway, so it shouldn't be what's on your mind when it's time to dance.

[gooseaholic]

Exactly my point.

[Professor]

I have 3 1/2" # 2's in my home defense gun. If it'll stop an alligator, it'll stop a thug.
Professor

[jws]

You get shot at 10-15' with bird shot and you ain't dead, your probably gonna wish you were.

[BigBrother]

Bird shot has more chance of completely stopping in tissue, instead of passing through.

In other words, full energy transfer from barrel to flesh. That's got to speak for something.

With that said, I would rather shoot a growed pig with buckshot, than bird shot.

[nitro5x6's]

Most of the folks I saw shot with buckshot retained the pellets within their body. Even Magnum Buck is running at 1200-1300 FPS and is of soft lead (some copper plated loads) It deforms in tissue and slows, rarely exiting the body in most of the shootings I saw. Last one was a 78 year old man hit high in the L Shoulder with a load of Remington Reduced recoil 8 pellet OO Buck. 7 pellets hit him and one pellet hit the wall behind him. He immediately ceased hostilities according to the LEO that shot him at the distance of about 20 feet. He lived. Messed up his bowling ability though.

[walt4dun]

00 + rifled choke in mine.
Patterns like this.
Improves the odds of the taxpayer not having to deal with them for long.

[Fish]

Bird shot has more chance of completely stopping in tissue, instead of passing through.

In other words, full energy transfer from barrel to flesh. That's got to speak for something.

Bird shot inside a typical bedroom or hallway will devastate tissue and the energy transfer will knock the lights out of your target. You put a load of 8's center mass at 20' and that dude ain't gonna make it.